pass/partition system like Softimage
I've been learning Blender for a few months and trying to transition from Softimage. I'm finding I can do a lot of things in Blender that I do on a daily basis making medical animation in Softimage. But I can't start a serious project without a true pass system. I'm not talking about collections, or render layers, or even the scene files embedded in a blend file. Blender needs an actual pass system with partitions to hide objects, change settings and basically create sub-scenes and variations of the main scene. Blender has been such a beast in the last year and I'm constantly amazed by what the devs are adding, but it makes me sad to see such a basic, fundamental scene organization tool like passes not implemented yet...or even discussed very much. Google it. It's a non-existent discussion. This feature would truly put Blender in the big leagues because I don't see how anyone can get anything done without passes...and if you've been getting by without them, then you have no idea how much easier your life can be.
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In essence, what the Softimage pass system does is create sub-scenes inside the main scene (in this case a Blend file) in a non-destructive way. It's hard to explain to someone who has never used something like this and who only think of passes as AOVs(reflection, refraction, etc). Actually, I can't imagine anyone getting anything complex done without the ability to partition off parts of a scene and override settings for different renders. It's my one main reservation about going all in with Blender. Yes, I do love rendering everything fully in camera like when I first started in Lightwave and never did post processing/comping, but clients specific needs in storyboards makes it impossible for me to just put everything in front of the camera and render. I have to separate things to do certain effects in After effects.
I have definitely been trying to keep as much in camera as possible because it makes for lighter After Effects projects, but like I said -- sometimes how I go about achieving parts of a storyboard are out of my control.
* @adrencg * I think Blender does have the potential do this with view layers and the scenes separation system, though the experience feels disjointed unlike one editor for the entire system in Softimage.
Some Example Screenshot from Softimage RenderPasses, Each pass has his own Camera Animation, Frame Range, Output Directory, hidden objects, hidden light, diffent Environment, different Render settings and RenderSystem.
{attachment SI_renderPasses_example01jpg}{attachment SI_renderPasses_example02jpg}
Collections and dynamic overrides will indeed become the Softimage equivalent... a good 12 years later, but there sooooon.. soon... hopefully very soon. Can't wait! I miss working with partitions.
* @Andres Stephens - Trinumedia * I think the newest version of C4D actually has something like this.
Lack of this is my main concern as well.
Add two new group types reserved for passes only and expose them in new View Layers. One for any kind of object except lights and one for lights (point, sun, spot and area).
Add the ability to place overrides onto these groups - whatever is in the group, should then inherit what was overriden. It could be render visibility. Visibility to camera rays, material etc.
Any stuff that didn't get any override, inherits from the main layer. This goes for Render and Output properties as well.
Material overrides should be possible on object level as well, since a single object can have multiple materials. Overrides on object level should have precedence over overrides in a group.
For rendering, there should be option to render current pass, selected passes and all passes (single frame and all frames, where "all" can be different from pass to pass).
With the above, Collections would become redundant - but personally, I wouldn't miss them.
Next step would be to create a pass and render manager, where the user in simple manner can go through whats currently known as render, output and view layer properties.
Tokens for file paths and names would become way more relevant too.
BTW: these pass specific groups can't be moved around or nested into each other and basic control at the very least is what Collections currently have (selectablity, visiblity in viewport and visibility in render).
I think you're talking about Dynamic Overrides which are in development, but still a ways away.
Hello adrencg! It is always a pleasure to read about the amazing features of the beloved Softimage. I have worked with Softimage for 8 years and I miss it. But today I use Blender and I found an Addon that might help you. It's called Shot Manager and is very close to the pass/partition system of Softimage, not so mutch for the overrides beacouse Blender have just for one material for the entire scene or something like this. Please try it and tell me what do you think. I would like to know it better and I confess you that I just scratch the surface of this great addon.
blendermarket.com/products/shot-manager
youtu.be/0s1vL00WVb0
PS I dont recive any money from the addon author, It's just a my dream have a for my work, a system like/almost softimage, but I need to help for learn it (unfortunately ther are few tutorials). I would like to write to you privately but I can't find the way on this site.
I may add some love on this idea.
As a Softimage user for close to 30 years now (still using it actually in saddly combination with Maya). I started to use Blender about four months ago and it really is a powerfull weapon to add to my pipeline.
Sooo I would love to see such a Killer feature like "Softimage Passes" inside Blender, actually is probably the last big feature that I miss and makes me hard to use in my day to day jobs.
Maya added a couple of years ago, a similar but overcomplicated copy of the same functionallity (Render Setup). Working with that software made my live a bit easier now, but as I said they overcomplicated it and it losses a lot of easy usability of the Softimage one.
I can try to explain to any developer how those two similar systems work from a user point of view if it may help get that feature in Blender.
I can even prepare some basic scenes to "picturize" the basic workflow.
Cheers, Ignasi aka Topeich
And... you can add in each Pass many diffent RenderChannels...
{attachment SI_renderPasses_example03jpg}
Since what you're describing sounds a lot like features that are currently already in Blender, you're going to need to be a lot more specific about what such a system can do and how it differs from what Blender already has. What's the workflow? Create mock-ups of how you envision this working within Blender's interface. Links to other software are only going to be of limited value.
* @Jason van Gumster * A partition in in Softimage is like a collection with overrides for rendering with it's own view layer whith in turn has it's own file output and render settings (even render engine) - which in turn creates a custom "pass" of all passes. Each partition can have it's own render pass data, but in essence it has it also has it's own render settings per partition/view layer.
Eg.
Blender will soon have overrides, has view layers, has a bin system called "collections" and has linked "scenes" which act like a render partitions. But it's UX is just cumbersome right now. Softimage in comparison had the whole system including file output and render settings all accessible and overridable right within the partition system of an "outliner| , including global list of "view layers" and all the overrides and custom collections each would have in the outliner list.. all in the same scene.
Right now you'd have to juggle between scene toggling, view layer toggling, going from the outliner to the properties render settings to the view layer settings. And the viewlayer is ultimately not very useful as no render settings are linked to the view layer, and overrides are also not linked to view layers, and scenes have their own view layers and they too are not linked to each other, and it's all disjointed, but in functionality.. it's close, but concerning UX, still far and thus its features are obscured.
* @Andres Stephens - Trinumedia * So do you have a design for how an improved workflow would be in Blender?
* @Jason van Gumster * Hmm.. a detailed design documentation could work. Right now it mainly needs just UI organization for a smoother UX which I can work on in a fork... But I'm still waiting on some feature like light assigning to objects/collections and better tried and tested overriding.
I believe this is a question for devtalk.blender.org/c/user-feedback , since in this site, usually they expect a more developed idea (with suggestions about how exactly the new feature should work, and whatever)... but...
Just to be clear: are you refering for something differente from what showing in this image: (for passes and sub-scenes with variations)
And for hide objects, did you try the "Holdout" options? Or with "partitions" you meand something totally different?
* @samuel.santos * Close but not the same thing. If you do a full copy, then if you make an edit to the modeling of an object it won't update in the other scene.
* @adrencg * If you make a "Linked Copy," and the object is in the default "Collection" folder (or any subfolders within the "Collection" folder), then the object will be updated in the other scene when you make changes to it in the current one. Moving an object out of the "Collection" folder removes it from being linked, and moving it back in will re-link it.
Hope that helps, I haven't found that documented in the manual.
* @adrencg * as "@MisquiteSource replied, I really meant the whole menu and their differente options.
In the link bellow there's explanation (even though it refers to 2,7x): blender.stackexchange.com/questions/72746/is-it-possible-to-copy-data-from-one-scene-and-paste-it-into-another-within-the
I already use this as a workaraound to render an object as mask in a differente scene, when Holdout material/render option was not available in 2.8.
* @samuel.santos * The Render Layer system is not as flexible as it should be. Not all render settings change across layers, you can't use different rendering engines per layer and other things.
* @bruno.souza.lino * That should be possible with Dynamic overrides, but they won't be done for a little while. I made a proposal about that subject, if you'd like to vote it up.
* @bruno.souza.lino * Yeah, I agree we should have more options to link one scene to another in different ways. But one workaround to render different render engine per layer is to use another scene linked.
Considering SoftImage was discontinued by Autodesk a few years ago, where can we see examples of the same system in current maintained software?
* @bruno.souza.lino * Try this video of a pass system written by Oliver Hotz as a LightWave Plugin. Its even written all in Python.
vimeo.com/showcase/4335852/video/267476272
Yes would love to see this!