Industry standard keymap ready for Blender 2.8 beta

@grauer.d: I've used quite a bit of 3d software and yes, those items listed are pretty standard except for placing the cursor. You say there are already shortcuts for w, e, and r, but w and r are addressed in his proposal. w moves to the right click. r is used for the very thing that you're suggesting it's already used for. E is left and this is going to be a difficult one to replace, but I agree with SebastianMRoy that these basic interactions should follow more of an industry standard to provide an entry point to anyone just wanting to test drive blender. The current interaction methods turn potential users away. It's the reason I was turned away for many years.

@skarnproject: I think we all agree that Blender's default keymap won't be replaced but we can add more keymaps, in fact, as many as we want as long as they are correct and approved.

@skarnproject: SERIOUSLY? DO YOU THINK THAT ALL THE PROFESSIONALS IN THE INDUSTRY ARE WRONG AND YOU ARE THE ONLY ONE WHO IS RIGHT? NOT RESPECTING THE IDEAS OF OTHERS MAKES EVERY NEW USER OF BLENDER WANT TO LEAVE.

@skarnproject: The logic behind using wer is that your hands always rest in position over those 3 keys. Then you aren't thinking about the letter that is written on the key, just that the ring finger starts the grab operation, the middle finger starts the rotation operation and the index finger starts the scale operation. 3ds Max adds the Q key or pinky finger for select. So, yes, SERIOUSLY.

This is not bad. It's just different.

@dpdpforlife: Exactly! That's my main concern with G which is the worst of those 3. Having them all in a row makes a lot of sense. Initials are good "initially" but who wants to look at the keyboard?

* @skarnproject * Most professional 3D tools use somewhat similar keymaps except Blender. 3Ds Max, Maya, Cinema 4D, Modo, Houdini, Unreal Engine, and Unity all use somewhat a similar combination of WER or ERT for transform tools.

@luisburdallo: Autodesk software uses w,e,r. I don't think the point is that blender is customizable so anyone can make it interact anyway they want. The point is that someone who just wants to try out the software should be able to sit down and mess with the software and do some simple things without having to spend hours figuring out what key bindings work for them.

@dpdpforlife: I totally agree with you. I was just stating some facts in case Blender is bothering any current user. Below I explained my perspective on this and I believe individual keymaps will be much better than a single one because it's not going to please anyone 100%.

@1d.inciner: If you use the traditional blender shortcuts you will continue using it, the rest is here developer.blender.org/T54963 . THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT, ALL THE USERS OF BLENDER SHOULD BE BETTER HOSTS, I MAKE AN INFORMAL SURVEY, SHOWING AN INDICATION THAT IS OPINION OUT OF BLENDER BECAUSE I WANT TO HELP TO PROMOTE, AND THE ONLY THING I LISTEN ARE COMPLAINTS THAT ONLY DO NOT WANT TO USE BLENDER, WE NEED TO BE GOOD HOSTS.

@sebastianmroy: How about we drop the all-caps shouting and keep the discussion civil?

@danielpaulus90: Wow thanks for that I didn't know that existed. So WER is the standard keys for MRS everywhere even tho some of them interchange them. Clearly, all applications should have a standard keymap setup so you can choose if you want to load that or the application defaults keymap. Will try to make one and share it if I have the time. Not sure if everything is doable.

@danielpaulus90: that collection clearly shows that there is no such thing as an industry standard, and just choosing a bunch of softwares and make the key thats used in most softwares doesnt make it a standard, just a average most used key, otherwise it would be present in all the softwares. this will be a mess....

@grauer.d: It wont be a mess, it still has a long way to go, but in the end it will be a good alternative for right click. Im a c4d user for years and im looking forward to this new keymap. Especially because i love to navigate with alt + left, right, middleclick

@grauer.d: The idea is to have an extra keymap in the menu for users from most applications that share the same keymaps. If everyone contributed to this we could even have a keymap for each application out there so any user could use Blender seamlessly with their other workflow applications and I think this would be the best way to approach this issue. Industry Standard would be only dictated by the top applications used by the industry but even those have some differences. No one, at least me, wants to just change Blender current keymap. It can always be as a default for people who are used to them and never changed them. I do change a lot of the default shortcuts and I will keep on doing so because I think some of them are not very intuitive.

@grauer.d: have you used other software besides blender? all the softwares of the world use the same interaction with the mouse, that can not be discussed, and the keymaps most of the softwares use it, and although it was not the majority of the softwares, with total certainty it is used by most of the people, because more than 70% of professionals use Maya and 3dMax.

@sebastianmroy: yes im familiar with other software and most use their own and doent seem to care what others are using. i agree that its a good time to optimize the keybindings but adapting some keybindigs form "the big players" is just wrong if its not working as good as what we currently have. im all for making it better, but lets have a unbiased discussion on what the best option is for a functionality and not just adapt something a other software uses, because that seems to be what a lot of people who come from a non-blender software seems to want. The motto of 2.8 was and i believe still is "workflow" release and should make us more efficient, and as it currently stands i feel most of the keybinding changes are doing the opposite, and that is not because its a new key but because its not effective to what the old way was. example 1.2.3 for element selection.

i also need to mention this once more, we need to be cautious that the default of blender will be a complete and stable binding, otherwise we will end up with everybody having different shortcuts, this would cant follow any tutorials unless you adapt the binding of the tutorial maker and a bunch of other issues related to that. So there is a certain danger to this flexibility. I have a team of artists and we all work with blender, and i could not imagine how messy it would be if everybody has his preferred bindings, almost impossible to quickly show something on a different system or do a workshop or any documentation on workflows that mention any bindings.... just a messy situation. maybe that shows a bit why im capacious when it comes to all those adaptions and open questions with the bindings and maybe also caused by the stagnant situation in the alpha, where the bindings got mostly removed, some changed and then left in that sorry state since then. speaking about that, anyone knows what the plan/roadmap is for the beta or release for the keybinding situation?

@grauer.d: I completely agree that the industry standard map shouldn't be on by default, but making a good industry standard keymap and having a way to select it from the start screen is 100% doable and necessary to attract new users.

@dpdpforlife: I agree with that. And I also think the industry standard is about the basic functions only and I don't think that's very hard to achieve and put it there as another keymap in the library for those who are just starting and come from another application. But I am all in for making individual keymaps for every single major software so no fights for who wins the ISK battle.

@luisburdallo: The only major hurdles I can see in the way of doing this right now are these:

The active tools don't work with left click select; or they do, but you cannot select with the tool active. You have to switch to the cursor tool to select and then switch back to the active tool.

The old trick of setting the mouse button to "Deselect All" no longer works. In 2.79 if you set two mouse click keybindings to "Deselect All" and "Select", then when you clicked in an empty space, deselect would work, but if you were over an object or element, it would select.

Other weird things tend to happen, like you have to use the right mouse to scrub through the time line.

@grauer.d: "I RESPECT THE DECISION OF BLENDER USERS WHO WANT TO CONTINUE USING THEIR TRADITIONAL WAY OF INTERACTION, I HOPE THEY CAN RESPECT MINE, WHICH IS BASICALLY WHAT IS USED IN ALL OTHER APPLICATIONS IN THE WORLD."   "There is no need to reinvent the wheel"

@dpdpforlife: I've been making a new keymap that contains most basic changes from the ISK proposal and so far so good with selecting/deselecting toggle with double click as right now a single click won't work. I've been using that for a long time and very intuitive and it avoids clicking outside by mistake and losing your selections (you can always undo). The problem I am facing is that it wouldn't work in Edit Mode but only for Object Mode and the reason being is that I already have the double-click for selecting loops. So that's a conflict that can only be fixed in the code as it needs to differentiate between hovering over edge, face, vertex and an empty area.

@luisburdallo: That's funny. I was just trying the same thing out. Drag for border select, double click to deselect. It works really well. I hadn't moved it to edit mode yet, but I can see other conflicts. For instance, the right mouse drag over an object doesn't move it reliably. Sometimes it does the grab operation and sometimes it does the border select.

@dpdpforlife: You mean holding the mouse down to move it and release mouse for dropping it? I didn't know it could be done as is currently designed. Check my bottom post because all those things from 3D View Tool reset back to default. I've been having this issue since I first tried to change the cursor default shortcut and once I got now all those select with LMB I lost them.