Editable Mesh Modifier
I've used 3ds Max for years and one of the most powerful modifiers it has is the Edit Poly modifier. It gives a really non-destructive approach to modeling, storing different mesh states on each modifier instance. I would love to see something similar done for Blender to continue building its already impressive modifier list.
I attached a mockup picture with a usage example of such modifier.
This idea was marked as a duplicate of Edit-Mesh Modifier.
32 Comments
this would GREATLY enhances Blender's modeling workflow. I know many 3DSmax colleagues who stick to max only for the "edit poly" workflow and I completely understand why.
Its kinda possible now with the "Edit Mesh" modifer in the Modifier List addon: extensions.blender.org/add-ons/modifier-list-fork/
This Would be so freakin' awesome.... Just a teardrop have appeared in the corner of my eyes <3
You can check out this video how it is for 3ds max. It's a really good way of working and will be a great addition for blender.
youtu.be/cKyaR2qCgR8
I am 3ds max user and wonder why there cannot be a modifier that just stores current state of the mesh in form of "live mesh cache". Meaning basic vertex order (numbers) stays put new ones get higher values but if you edit your "base mesh" then anything that is in that base vertex order gets somewhat transferred down the pipeline. If it's not possible mesh just breaks but you can always undo.
As another 3ds Max refugee I'd like to voice my support for this proposal! This, along with UV Edit modifiers would allow me to abandon 3ds Max happily.
This is an integral part of 3dsMax and I believe this would greatly benefit Blender users as well.
I am actually surprised that this is not a feature. I often used Edit Mesh or Edit Poly and loved that I could stack them. Another option would be to just create a histogram save similar to photoshops, which is in essence what the Edit Mesh or Edit Poly helps do. The only difference is that when you stack them, you can disable different editing stages. Such as ,if I create a body and add Edit Poly and adjust arms on a body, the another to adjust legs, the stacks could be turned on or off to undo changes to that specific portion of the model.
Also I could rename these stacks "Arms" "Legs" "Torso" go back and do small edits on those portions at any point. There are some things that do not work well in 3DMax with this method when going back, such as if you manipulate something on the Arms area while having "legs" selected, may cause weird issues with the stack order..
To maybe further improve on what 3dMax did, assigning these portions to a specific stack would perhaps keep that from happening.
this would be very useful :)
Amazing proposal, I've just recently started learning 3DS Max, and it would be super useful to have something similar in Blender, because instead of applying modifier stack, you could do the changes with it. It would make the modeling process so much less destructive.
A nice one. For the issue it may generate (which as far as i remember where the same in max) it could be something like this: the modifier becomes a "start point mesh" that overrides everything that's before it (as ocean modifier can do). Whenever you want to change the previous mesh you have to discard the modifier but in this case an option to create a new object might be useful to not lose the modeling done
This could be very handy but seems pretty tricky to develop. For example what would happen if you clicked to disable a modifier that was made before an edit mesh modifier ? I guess it would have to disable all the modifiers below to prevent the mesh from breaking. Also, to optimize memory usage it would have to store the relevant data very smartly, like a versioning system such as Mercurial. This would be awesome and I could see such a tool be implemented in the "everything nodes" project, but with the current modifier system I'm not sure it's worth the time and effort to develop it. At least I doubt core developers would want to. Maybe I'm wrong though.
@Caetano Veyssières: Those are exactly my concerns. I do remember in Max your mesh messes up when you disable some modifier previous to the EditPoly one, but such is the nature of the modifier itself, can be very powerful but it has to be used with care.
I do also believe it might be too much work to implement but even if taken into consideration for "everything nodes" would be great.
@pintorfj: Isn't this also the case now with mesh deform that will complain with 'Verts changed from xx to YY.' and will disable it's output.
* @Caetano Veyssières * Yeah it seems like it would perfectly fit in the Everything node project. Houdini does something similar.
I believe it could work exactly like the Surface Deform Modifier. It has a Bind button to capture the state of the mesh. If you do anything in the original mesh that alters the number of vertices or the order of face ids the modifier would simply stop working and you would have to rebind it. This is a extremely useful modifier that should have been implemented so long ago. I understand that developers have a list of priorities but this would open so many doors for non destructive modeling.
Why do we need non-destructive modeling if we have destructive modeling?
The closes thing to this right now is probably "Edit mesh" in Modifier list: extensions.blender.org/add-ons/modifier-list-fork/ But I hope there will be a offical way to do it soon.
I really want this, it's the one thing I really miss from 3DS Max.
vote!
Amazing proposal
We used it in max a lot, but the tendency to mess with the stack was huge, specially when you changed the topology of the stack. Having a proper base to work on top is far more reliable. Specially when working in a team you never knew why the modifier was added.
You can use KTX mesh versions for this purpose. Try it!. Already built in and approved.
* @ Vyacheslav * The point is not versioning the mesh, but editing ur object on top of another modifier without applying it. it's not possible with that plugin. Imagine using mirror modifier, after 'edit poly' modifier so now u can edit the mesh. Super Useful. Keeping things non destructive.
Absolutely, I'm surprised this would be a huge improvement.
A possible "cheap" solution is to have a new mesh datablock originated from the modifier. So that the object has both links the old one (inactive) and the new one (old mesh with all previous modifiers applied)
An idea like this extends way beyond the modifier stack. What would the workflow look like for non-modeling activities that involve directly selecting and manipulating geometry (e.g. weight painting, UV unwrapping, shape keys)?
While a feature like this is powerful, there are far-reaching consequences throughout the rest of Blender's interface. This proposal should really address those questions directly.
@Jason van Gumster: In 3ds Max everything works through modifiers, including UVs, Vertex Paint, etc.
In case of Blender, the Mesh Edit should affect all these parameters (selectable by checkboxes that override the previous state). This could even make for a more powerful modifier as you could edit individual aspects of the mesh, like UVs alone or vertex groups, etc.
I'm probably overreaching here as I have no idea what amount of work might be involved in this proposal.
@pintorfj: It's fine to "overreach"... that's what ideas are all about. However, even if you have a small notion of how much work is involved, you should put similar effort into your proposal. This idea has long tentacles that reach into all kinds of other parts of Blender. How about some mock-ups that include those override checkboxes? Perhaps some images that show an example workflow for how someone may do weight painting with this kind of modifier active?
The more you think this through and the more effort you make into your proposal, the more actionable the idea is for a developer to make it happen.
@Jason van Gumster: That is a pretty good idea, honestly I didn't think about these ramifications in the first place, I will work on elaborating further the proposal with images and examples.
@Jason van Gumster: Jason you're right. You are right as a developer, but as an artist you are wrong :) Let me explain.
This is a very strange decision not to add a tool that will work fine, but will not work with some other tools.
Yes, this concept will not work with drawing weights, uvs and other tools. Even if this modifier will work only with modeling, this is a very good step forward and a good assistant in modeling. If you need to draw weights or work with uvs, then you need to collapse all modifiers. Yes, it would be great if we will have also Drawing Weights and UVs and other modifiers, but even with one Editable Mesh modifier this is very very useful.
@Axel Mening: I'm not a developer.
If this modifier wont work for UVs or weight painting, I'm OK with that... but the proposal should at least mention these other workflows and how this modifier either works with them, or doesn't.